The Divorce Chapter
This podcast is for you if you have found yourself unexpectedly single and absolutely shitting it.
The Divorce Chapter is all about writing the next bit of your story and remembering, this is just one chapter… it’s not the end or miserable ever after.
I am Sarah Elizabeth, and I am a divorce coach and mentor and founder of The BLOSSOM Method®, passionate about supporting and empowering women to create a much happier life post divorce. Each episode is your inspiration to explore your emotional, psychological and practical needs outside of the legal process.
I’ll be sharing stories, tips, learning and ALL the things every Friday, to help you make this chapter the best goddamn one yet and turn the divorce plot twist into a happy ending.
The Divorce Chapter
EP50 The Single Spark Chapter: From Divorce to Development and Dating with Chantelle Dyson
In this episode of "The Divorce Chapter" podcast, we welcome the brilliant Chantelle Dyson, a certified life coach, educator, speaker, and podcast host.
Chantelle, who divorced in her 20s after only a year of marriage, shares her journey of self-discovery and personal growth.
She discusses the societal pressures that often dictate life choices, such as marriage and children, and emphasises the importance of understanding and defining happiness on our own terms.
Chantelle explains how her divorce prompted a deep dive into personal development, leading her to slow down and embrace a more intentional and fulfilling life. She also touches on the challenges of loneliness, particularly the kind that stems from not sharing meaningful experiences with others, and offers insights into how she has navigated these feelings.
Throughout the episode, Chantelle's story is one of resilience and empowerment, encouraging us to take control of our lives and make conscious, fulfilling choices.
The books that Chantelle recommends in the episode:
Lost Connections by Johann Hari
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1408878720/ref=nosim?tag=thedivorceb00-21
You were not born to suffer Blake D Bauer
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1525246119/ref=nosim?tag=thedivorceb00-21
And you can find Chantelle here:
And on Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/chantellethecoach/
I hope you love hearing Chantelle talk as much as I loved chatting with her 💜
So until next week,
Sending you SO much love
Sarah x
🌸
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https://thedivorcebookclub.com/free-resources/
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Sarah Elizabeth 00:00
Hello and welcome to the divorce chapter podcast where we turn that unexpected divorce plot twist into happily ever after with me, your host, Sarah Elizabeth. And this week we have another wonderful guest to help us with making our divorce chapter the best goddamn one yet, and that is Chantelle Dyson, aka Chantelle the coach. Chantelle is a certified life coach, educator, speaker and podcast host with experience in mindset, confidence, leadership, personal development and dating and relationships as a love and life coach. She helps women and girls to learn their worth, overcome the challenges we face as women and become empowered to step into their femininity. She is a trained Jay Shetty Certified Life and success coach, and the host of weekly podcast the single spark. Chantelle has been featured in the press interviewed on radio and taken part in panels as well as running workshops and events for women and young people on personal development relationships and feminist issues. Her first two programmes, single life confidence and back to dating have helped hundreds of single women to take ownership of their single life. And when they're ready to get back to dating and accept no bullshit along the way. You are one very busy woman Chantelle.
Chantelle Dyson 01:21
Oh, well, when you have been in teaching, you don't know what busy is. Old habits die hard. There we go.
Sarah Elizabeth 01:30
Well, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for coming on.
Chantelle Dyson 01:33
Thank you for having me. I'm super excited for this.
Sarah Elizabeth 01:37
Okay, so I know you're divorced yourself, Chantelle. And you divorced in your 20s. Right?
Chantelle Dyson 01:45
I did indeed. Yes.
Sarah Elizabeth 01:46
So can you tell us a bit more about your backstory if you like, and your work that led to this, where you are now.
Chantelle Dyson 01:54
Yeah so as you mentioned, I divorced in my 20s. And that was at the age of 26. But only after a year of marriage. We'd been together since I was 19. And once you're divorced, I think you make sense of it afterwards. At the time, you almost can't make sense of what's going on, necessarily. And I think the more invested you are in it, the harder it is to make sense of it. But even in my one, it was the idea of not thinking this was the right thing anymore came about because once you get married, suddenly everyone's like, when kids, when are they on their way? When's that happening? And I was like, I don't know if I am ready for this. And we did have some discussions about kids that we probably didn't want them immediately. But then I started to think, I don't know, if I want them really at all. And I've done all the chats of gonna be how will we make this work? What will we do, but I just couldn't actually see that I wanted to even do that. And I've started to question not just that, but everything. And I was like, Oh, I don't think I know what I even really want. I don't know, I don't feel like I know how I've got myself into this position. Even though obviously, I'm totally in control of my own life and my own decisions. But I feel as if I hadn't made a conscious decision. I was unconscious, but it's that whole like, you just go along with it. Because no one's ever told you any other way. Why or and my parents did divorce when I was I think was working out yesterday to be something like 10. So it's not like divorce is something that I'd hadn't seen. But I don't think anyone shows a different picture of you find someone, you fall in love inverted commas, you build a life together, buy a house, have kids have decent jobs on the way that's very much the what's painted as the norm the expected yet I think the stats are its like 50% of marriages end in divorce, something like that. So actually 50% of children in well not necessarily children, I mean that's just marriages. But I mean, I would imagine 50% of children end up in separated homes that these blended families. And I don't think that is spoken about enough. And I don't think we're ever painted this idea that it might not go right, it might go wrong. You don't have to follow that path to be happy. What does happy look like? And I don't think it's a school thing. I think that's just a society thing. It can be brought into schools, but it's, it was me going, Oh, I don't think I've really done this. And it's that classic. I think I need to find myself. I didn't describe it that way. But I think that ultimately is probably the cliche of what it was. I just, I was doing everything I was a maths teacher, I quite enjoyed that at the time, even that ran its course of like, it's cool, but I don't think I've explored half as much I've probably done the foundational work of having already inverted commas great life, according to everyone else's definition. I don't really know what that definition is for me. So I need to reset start over. And unfortunately, there's going to be some collateral with this in terms of having to reset a life for my ex and for the families on both sides that have obviously bonded over the six, seven years that we were together, and all of that so that's how we got to where we are now although how many years are we out now? Five, its five years out this summer? So yes, it's, I mean, we've COVID in there. It's flown?
Sarah Elizabeth 05:06
Well, oh, yeah, of course, I can imagine. Yeah. Cos that was must have been just pre COVID. Right? Yeah, yeah.
Chantelle Dyson 05:11
So I mean, I dread to think what the situation could have been like, if I had not made the move, then you're like, how do we deal with being in a zone together the whole time, if I'm not feeling sure about it, et cetera, like that could have been a totally different experience. So that's why you sometimes have to think, thank goodness, I did it when I did it. Because there's no better time than the soonest point, really, because there could have been lots of different things, you can't rebuild your life or start over until you've left that one. So it's really, it's that tough. Put your big girl pants on decision, making the decision going through with it and the amount of people that try and pull you back from it, because they're worried about you making a mistake, I think, slash maybe I don't know, for sure. But maybe my parents becoming protective because they went through the same thing, and they don't want that for their daughter. So having chats with almost like, have to explain it. Whereas I'm quite once I'm decided I've decided. So there wasn't a lot of convincing, you're talking round or making me doubt myself. I was pretty like, Well, no, this is what I think is the best for me. So I'm going with it. But to have to do the conversation over and over everyone was quite, quite exhausting at times. Yeah, we got through that.
Sarah Elizabeth 06:22
Yeah, totally. I think. I think a lot of the time, though, as well, it's other people's being uncomfortable, isn't it? Because you're so right, it is society's kind of expectation, isn't it? You know, I always say you kind of in the relationship for however long, four or five years or whatever. And then it's like, well, when are you getting engaged? And then you get engaged. And then it's like, what, two years and then people are like when you get married, and then you get married? And it's like when you have in your first kid. And then you have your first kid, then it's like when you're having a second. And then if you have to have the same sex like I did, I had two boys. And it's like, when you're gonna have a girl. And it's like, people, it's just the way society and culture is, isn't it? That it's kind of like this is the, this is the way you do it. And if you don't do it this way, it's, there's something wrong. It's like it sets off alarm bells and people, right, you know, it's kind of it makes them question their own decisions, and whether they're doing the right thing, and whether they're happy in what they're living, you know,
Chantelle Dyson 07:21
Its chasing the next thing as well, which causes a lot of distress amongst us because No wonder no one feels like they've got anything to show for because someone's mentioning that they should be doing this next. And then you don't have that. So you're focused on a bit that you don't have when instead, you need to be looking at the things that you do have. And you're like, oh, actually, like, I've, I've got this image. So, you know, even when I went back to live at home after getting divorced, it was like, Okay, I've got the money out of the house now. So like, this is okay, it's not the end of the world. I'm living in a situation where my rent is minimal. Thanks, mum and stepdad. Look at what I've got. And I think one of the biggest things that came out of the divorce and that the whole reason me that I don't know if this happens for every life occurrence, and every divorce depends on the person. But I kind of vowed that I would never let this happen again, in the same way. Like getting into a situation where I hadn't been like, this is what I decided I wanted rather than like, being in a trance as it were, and going with the flow. I was I was like, I need to do the work of work out why this has happened to stop it happening again. So the personal development deep dive was huge. Like I was going to bed at 8 or put my phone in the room. I going into my bedroom at nine. I don't know what I was doing journaling, meditating a bit of everything, go to sleep by 10 wake up at five doing proper 5am Club stuff, all of that
Sarah Elizabeth 08:44
wow.
Chantelle Dyson 08:45
Yeah, it was it was great, because it was all the work that you do in those meditations, whatever book you're using to guide you through whatever coaching calls program, etc. You're, in my opinion, you're trying to work out exactly who you are and why you're the way you are. And the art of that then helps you to understand what happened in your past. Even if it wasn't great, like experiences weren't as they should be inverted commas, I don't think there is a way they should be but like losing detachments to what maybe this could have happened in my childhood, but it did and my parents were acting in the best way they could and so all the people around me. It's a case of it very much brought back what I did get to do and very much one of those shifts I had was looking always at what you get to do, even if you're not in your perfect scenario. So building my business now whether it's life coaching or podcasting, I'm miles off where I want it to be like I have visions of some sort of big event I don't I still don't quite have the full vision mapped out with some sort of big event for singles. And not like a single party. Literally just the conference, a personal development event of some description to help people work on that great. I've been doing this now for since 2021 Off the top of my head to do as always, yeah. So three years. That's that's baby, but some people were like, Why haven't you made x y Z? Why haven't you got an event with 1000 people yet it's like, whoa. I can rush. But actually I'm having a good time working it out, I've got no business background prior to this teaching, I've got my whole life to deal with got a new relationship. I mean, like, there's lots going on, I'm just gonna, I'm gonna enjoy the ride, rather than being in a rush all the time. And I was a rusher, so like, if I've cured myself of anything in some way, or changed, I think slowing down and being okay with not being on the go without sounds like I'm always very busy. Actually, I have a lot of downtime, I'm not gonna lie on that it was something that I prioritized. And I just, I'm not in a rush, whether it's in a relationship, whether it's in a home or with the business, of course, I want to I need to make things financially viable, of course, I want my relationship to be good. But there's no pressure to be moving 100 miles an hour anymore. Like, we're over that predominantly. And I think that's a great, great thing that came as a result of a divorce and actually doing the work.
Sarah Elizabeth 11:00
That totally I think that's really good. And you're creating your own timeline and your own way of doing things the way you want to do. And a lot of us don't, I think we have gone along that society timeline, the society's expectations and found ourselves. You know, I found myself divorced at 40 after being with my ex for 23 years. And it was kind of now what I was supposed to do. What do I do now? You know it. And it does make you sit back and look at how you've lived how you've done things and breaking the patterns, I guess as well. Yeah, definitely, definitely. Dangerous. I think one of the issues, it's kind of interesting, because we obviously we've, we were saying just before we pressed record about you're a millennial, I'm a Gen X. You know, I don't know whether it is different for the generations. But one of the things I think my generation and certainly I've experienced and a lot of my listeners experiences about loneliness. And I know, you on a recent podcast you did about a you talked about a quote about loneliness, about not being physical. Can you talk a bit about how you've experienced loneliness? And how you deal with that and managed that before you started your new relationship?
Chantelle Dyson 12:15
Definitely, absolutely. So I'll give the quote as well. And I'll do my best to do it from memory so that people know so it's from the book Lost connections by Johann Hari. And the quote is, he's quoting someone else. But its, loneliness isn't the absence, the physical absence of other people he said, it's the fact that you're not sharing anything meaningful with anybody else, it's along those lines. Because what you can do is you can arrange to have your life spending it with loads of people. So part of my history with my ex, lovely guy, by the way, not got anything against him. And it wasn't a bad relationship, per se, there wasn't any like thing that made me leave, it was purely like an internal choice. Maybe not in as much as we could have done. But we both started being together when we're both in the theatre world. And then I went into teaching. So that role is that they go to work at roughly 5pm and then come home at 10 get home at midnight, and then I will be getting up at six to go to work for seven and then finishing at three and then almost by the time we got home, we wouldn't we went across just at that point there. So I did do a lot of things in the evenings. I did like boot camps. I went on lots of socials, I was kind of the social sector always fallen into that role in groups. I mean, aren't we doing this Saturday, what we're doing that and it wasn't like Highlife when it was going to Los Iguanas or something like that and doing plenty with where we could depending on days off and things like that. So I had lots of things going on. But then when I was single, this didn't necessarily stop, you know, going to see people bar COVID I mean, that really did put some spanners in the works. But, you know, one of the first things I did we had our delayed honeymoons that we had to redeem essentially. So I went with a friend, but then went out on bits a big part of the loneliness comes from not share. It's the not sharing. I didn't feel like anybody really necessarily knew me. And I found going through the divorce. The decision making was easy. The dealing with it after and having to share with people was the hardest because it meant opening up the most. I remember being in a car park at work, and one person had turned to me I can't remember that was one of the few people left. I can't remember going in early for summer or something. But he turned to me and he goes, you're going back to Lakeside effectively, you're going back to Lakeside now, aren't you? Blah, blah, and I just burst into tears. I was like, No, I don't live there anymore. Because you've got to tell everyone that you've gone through that I mean I was semi close within a working professional relationship with that person anyway, so it didn't bother me that I'd got upset in front of them. But it's that whole thing of being really vulnerable. And that's scary because then it's it's it's always like the idea that you have different personalities around different people and that's not because you're trying to pretend to be something you're not you just you're that way with those people. That was those people. And I was like, no one knows all these things. And all this work that I'm doing internally now journaling and meditating. No one really knows any of that, because I didn't know it. So how can I have shared that with anyone if I didn't know that in the first place? So of course, there's this element of loneliness. Because then I've been living a life that wasn't aligned. But no one knew that I wasn't to know no one else was to know to no one's fault. And I think this classically comes out as a quarter life crisis, because it's, it's the early point that your values and the way you were brought up does not match what you now think you want, or you're not even sure what you want. And you're feeling locked into situations, which is where I was, or you feel locked out that you're not got what everyone else has got. So that was another thing I discovered. But the loneliness comes from. We like to keep up with the Joneses. We like to keep up appearances. We like to look like we're doing well. Yet no one knows. We're struggling. So one of my biggest developments alongside slowing down was to, to like literally send messages to people when I was feeling really bad. And I mean, like, not come around and bring wine. That's not my forte anyway. But like, Yeah, can I talk to you, because I don't even know why I'm upset right now. But I'm just like, I just don't feel like I matter. Or it feels like if I disappeared, no one would even care. I think that's the kind of loneliness you feel. So you don't, no one really knows who you are. You're not sharing anything that means anything to people, because you don't know what matters to you. You think putting a picture on social media basically cut out social media, or did it in a very effective way, I got rid of all of the celebrities, I deleted a lot of my old posts. I didn't post I very rarely post on my personal profile now, maybe partly then, once a month that best detaching from all of that starting to write Who do I need to spend the most time with? Who do I get the most from in an energetic way? Not from a resource way? Who can I start sharing things with more? How can I let people in more? How can I let people know what I'm thinking that I feel safe around that develops a relationship. So now I have this really, they're not tight knit as a five, but I'm close with all of them. And so that tight group, so the only time they ever are around each other most of the time is my birthday, although some by just chance have started to do the park run. And they're kind of all in the same place at the same time. But they're only connected generally by like myself, as opposed to doing it for any other reason that they're so that's quite nice. But I think it's finding the people to have properly close relationships with. I don't think many, many of us have that. In reality, I think we have a lot of acquaintances, we have a lot of friends, but not people that we would open up to and say I'm actually really struggling or like, yeah, and I don't do that so much anymore. I don't need that level of support. But I would say for the first year after the the end of the relationship, I think that was the key bit, especially during COVID. I mean, that really brought stuff out because, yeah, to socialize, so yeah, that it's really like you don't matter to me, like you don't really belong in that someone doesn't see you for who you are, and you're not sure if they would accept you to if you like started to reveal stuff. Yeah. True loneliness come from it. It's not being on your own. Because there are plenty of single people that do live on their own. They're absolutely fine. And I got to that point. Yeah. And the amount of people that message me, and they go when I had the single girls club, they'd be like, can I come along, but I'm in a relationship? And I'd be like, Oh, well, I'm gonna stop you. It's not really for you, though there. Any friends? All I've got is my one partner and I don't have a close relationship. So this is not just with people that are divorced people that are single, this is these goes quite wide. And I think it's got a lot to answer for. For us, we have societal issues in general, because people don't feel like they belong. And they thought the way to do it social media. And we've got it all in the wrong places.
Sarah Elizabeth 19:01
Yeah, I think you're right. I think there's such a focus on it being the romantic relationship is the the relationship that you get your closeness and connection with people. And then when that goes, it's that feeling that you are on your own and you can't share, isn't it but I always say there were times in my marriage that I was lonelier than I've ever been on my own. And I think but it takes a while to kind of grasp that, doesn't it? Like, certainly early on. I'd never lived on my own and never been on my own and it was kind of Oh shit. I don't I don't know what's happening. Like, I don't like it. I don't like being on my own. So I was always busy. I was always distracting myself. I was always doing this and that and the other. And then it's completely the other way now and bordering hyper independent. I'm just just doing it all on my own and I'm fine and completely the other the other end now but it's a bit of a journey to get there but it is definitely about connection. And I always say, I'm very similar. I've got a lot of close friends that are all individually not connected, but they're connected to me. And, you know, I definitely always advocate for having that support squad to, to have people around you that that get you and, as you say except you, right?
Chantelle Dyson 20:19
Yeah, absolutely. And it's, it's people that you could call on for anything, I'm not saying they're always gonna be able to drop, but be there at the drop of a hat like, and since since I was separated, their situations have changed. Two of them have had children since then one of them is now married. That's not an issue. But you know, they their priorities changed. But that wouldn't stop them being there for me if they could, but they've got everything to work on. And I think sometimes singles or people that don't have children maybe even cross it that way. Like, are the kids always there in the way? And it's like, well, yeah, because the priorities have changed. And you've got to work with that. Now I want to hang out with them on my own. That's cool. Tell them that and share that the same time have you to hang out with them and their kid now like, and if you want to put up a boundary, then I'll only hang out with you and you're on your own fine. But they're gonna find that more difficult than if you say, oh, but do you want to bring the little one along to Wetherspoons? When we go for breakfast? Or do you want to meet him at home like we can do either. And then Oh, thanks. Making it easy for me, like depends on what you value that relationship to but and also being like, look, he's coming off the last two or three times you might if we have one with skills on our own and, and your your husband can look after him and every now you Nikkei but they're not, they're not going to think of you. And that's not because they don't care about you. It's just because they haven't thought about it. People are really thinking about us. And like doing it intentionally, I just think I just don't even think they've considered it. I don't even think that when people go, I have a single person I haven't been given across one. Well, maybe they've just got 75 people and they can literally only invite you. So recently, I was invited to a very good friend's wedding. It was myself and never asked for an extra person. I was with Jason. So in theory I could have possibly gone on and Jason cover totally doesn't know them. I mean, he's met. I've got to keep Jason entertained more for that event. Then I have myself where I don't know that many people either. I'm like, I'll just go on my own. And I'll work it out. And I'll take my car and leave. If it's that bad. I don't think it will be. I made myself useful. I did all the videos, it was great. So I just think embrace that. When you're given like that to do on your actually I don't have to worry about Jason soz Jason, he won't mind because he'd be like, Well, I don't know anyone. He's got to work really hard to talk to people. That's not his forte social occasion. So actually, you've done me a favour, I'm not even single that having just a solo invite so much easier for us, he'd have to have got the kids looked at Oh God, the faff know, what it's called, Oh, my. So many like positives. When you're in I know people go, Well, you didn't have the choice because some people go oh, you know, you're going on your own as a choice. I mean, half isn't half isn't I mean, I could have asked, I could have still said no. And so I still know, its embracing the opportunity of it's like, okay, I'm on my own at a wedding. So I'm going to need to work a bit harder talking to people, because otherwise I really am just going to be on my own. And like it forces you, when when you take someone with you, you don't talk to anybody else almost for that entire year. And it's something to do if you go to a bar with friends that are in couples, they're more inclined to sit down, and therefore you have no opportunity of meeting anyone at this bar. Whereas if you're out with single friends, potentially, they're not going to sit at a sit down table, you might be like that stand at the bar and try and meet people because you want the social interaction potentially with other people have like, Oh, let's see we meet on the dance floor, etc. So just they keep you in that if they're already in relationships, if you're trying to go out and you know, do a little bit of meeting some guys getting a number or to see in a different form of dating to date. So there's loads of opportunities in single life. And I think that's one of the biggest things that I went for is that there's opportunity in it rather than it's a life limiting factor. And I think that has to be remembered. So I know divorce, or any end of a relationship sucks. But we only really sucks that much because we think that we should be with someone one person for like the entirety, but actually get past that Heartbreak. Or there's so much good stuff to think or live. And it's like, Oh, I haven't had this since I was in my 20s or whatever it might be in your life. This is great.
Sarah Elizabeth 24:25
I totally agree. And I think it is about you saying about a wedding. I've just had a wedding and before the wedding someone said to me Oh, who are you going to take to the wedding? I'm like, Well, no one. Why would I take anyone? It didn't even cross my mind that there would be a whole plus one situation and he was like, why would I take anyone
Chantelle Dyson 24:47
They gave it to you as a single person, you know, single, some would argue well, I should be well, you know, that person's got them invited and they've never even met so why can't I have a friend with me? If I didn't do plus ones at my wedding if I hadn't really met that person I'm going back through No, like all my friends from my activity camp. They were just invited on their own. No plus ones might. So my mum's friend's daughters. They were invited, but not their partners. Now, I mean, that's far enough. All right, I've connected anyway, let alone anything else. I don't think we did many. It was one plus one. And they bought their mum and I knew the mum better than I knew their partner that made loads of sense to me. I was like, Yes, bring her with you. That sounds wonderful. But the whole plus one situation, whether you're single, why? I just think let brides and grooms generally get on with what they want to do.
Sarah Elizabeth 25:43
Whenever you're given an opportunity, absolutely. But I think that sums it up, doesn't it? It's about, like reframing being single. And seeing it as an opportunity. Right, you know, big chunk of coping with divorce, coping with breakup is about reframing our perception of how we should live. And you know, especially when we've grown up on that Disney diet. Yeah. For Prince Charming and all that shit.
Chantelle Dyson 26:17
Well, I think the the definitely the expectation that like, you've got to be with one person and like that was the one we've been on language doesn't help us on that. But reframing can be so much harder. I think I'm quite a good reframe. I don't know, I think I've all I've contemplated this. And I've tried to thrash it out with Jason and I haven't taken it too much more of a platform beyond this. But I think I have a natural tendency towards positivity and optimism. So therefore, it's easier for myself to reframe, whereas women are more Oh my God, what's the word for it when you look at the not its not pessimism. But they just they see negatives more they see risk more? Yeah. So I don't know, on the whole how people feel. But I think people neurotic might be the word. When people have that thought it's much harder to then do the reframing work, because I think it's like, anything happens, I'll be like, well, there's going to be a reason if I'm gonna like, like lateness does bug me. But I'm not if it gets to a point where I've done everything I normally do, which is like, leave half an hour early, just because I like to be that take my time. But if you know, if three buses go past or a fall, or if the trains are delayed, oh, I'll go to pret, pick something up and just take someone I can obviously if it's a job interview, you're feeling a bit more stressed, but you still can't do anything about it. So I very much I let go very easily in that sense. Whereas I know that for others like that would be like I should have done something more I should have put more time in I should have done this and it becomes like self loathing, I think that can happen with anything. I could have done more in the relationship. I shouldn't have let this happen. I'm a failure because I've left or because I've had to leave or because they've divorced me. And I think unfortunately, there's a there's a waiting doors that's gonna make you more likely some people have got more work to do than others to get themselves out, although. So I love a reframe. I don't know if it's as easy for everybody to achieve a refund.
Sarah Elizabeth 28:06
No, I agree. I probably there's a lot of fear. I think especially in older women as well, when they have been married and for quite a long time. It's it's the fear of the unknown. Yeah, who's gonna want me what what does being on my own look like developing that confidence in yourself and having that worth in yourself to understand how it can look, rather than the fear of and another thing, priority I suppose on intimate relationships on romantic relationships, that then when you are on your own after divorce, the you know, again, it's that kind of expectation, I suppose, you know, you you get over your divorce, however long that's going to take and then you go start dating, and then it's how do you start dating? And it's like, Oh, my God, and there's so much of, you know, I mean, I'm quite cynical about dating. I did all the sites. I did all of you know, the tinder and Bumble and everything else. But I kind of I, you know, when I met my ex husband, I was 17. I met him actually weirdly play indoor cricket, which is random. But you know, that's how you met people then, you know, there was lonely hearts columns, but they were for really, really sad people you didn't do with the online dating, you didn't do that. And then you kind of. there's so much out there there's, you know, the dating pool is a bit murky. Let's be honest. It's full of you know, so plenty of fish and mostly anchovies.
Chantelle Dyson 29:34
And it's not, it's not pretty. And then that adds to the feeling right? It's all like, Oh my God, what's happening in my life, which makes sense that we'd find really hard. You know? So like, what are you looking for at that age? Because when you're in your 20s and 30s and again, it's wrong to assume that someone could assume wrong about me. i You like that I want to get married and have kids like kids Yeah, not sure I want to ever get married again, like it's not on my list. But there's more of and I can imagine that there's more of a, that's definitely what people want. Like when you're like, once you've done the kid bit and you've moved, be like, What? What? And it doesn't have to look particular way. But what does it look like for you? I think that's probably one of the biggest differences in dating. Actually, I don't think it's a difference. I just think there's more emphasis on it. When you're more pressure is, yeah, because people are going go, you gotta find someone to marry ASAP. And you've got to get married and have kids. But when you're older in that pool, actually, and you might have done a significant amount of that, like, what do you want this relationship to be? Because you've got so many different models you mentioned earlier, as well, the sort of predominance on focusing on a romantic partner to solve loneliness, one of my other little moments. So moment, I think, number six is what you were referring to earlier about loneliness. But the one before that moment, five talks about what is love as a relamping. Sternberg triangle, the theory of love. And there's these three elements to it, which is, if I get it right intimacy is in liking someone knowing lots about them passion, not just in the bedroom or anything, but the energy that people have for one another. And then there's commitment, and you can apply to any friendship or anything like that often gets used with romantic ratio. And in the middle is consummate love. It's the evenness of all three. And they obviously, relationship doesn't stay in all three of those all the time. But what are you what are you looking for companionship, so therefore, it's mostly intimacy, and commitment, and the passion is going to change and it's going to look different to what it would have done potentially, in your 20s, it will have elements of that is it that you are and this is where you get more sort of semi casual relationships. So you take you have a commitment, seeing one another, but it's just the passion and the energy and the time you're there. But you don't really care about them as a person their day in day out. Most people don't want the messy bit I think of any, I might have been putting a blanket on people there, working out what you want, and going on those apps with intent. I think, with the whole, the no BS approach to dating is knowing what you want and just going for that rather than trying to fit someone else's oh, what I might want kids, why don't want kids well, I might want to move in together. But I don't want to I'm always gonna want my own house, like going with what you think you want best. And you're allowed to change your mind. Even if literally, last month, you said, you'd never live with anyone that you've had a couple of dating experiences with someone, and they've made you reconsider. Because when there's no one on the cards, it's pretty easy to be like, it's just my space. No one's coming in it. Never Never living someone until you start dating someone you're like, oh, it's really nice to have someone around because you forgot what it was like? Would I want to have a whole? How do you want to buy together? Or are you always going to want to separate homes, but you spend half and half? Like, do you want to do a head on the bottom card, Tim Burton, when you have your house perforated by the wall, they did it. And it's they're not together anymore, but like, I'm sure it contributed to some of their enjoyment of the relationship, they could have two separate spaces, and we're like, off you go, go what's yours just by moving between that. So I think breaking that
Sarah Elizabeth 32:59
I think that happens a lot for the older divorces, that's happening a lot in sort of those second relationships and second marriages, that they're keeping their own homes and kind of meeting in the middle a couple of nights, three nights a week, whatever. And keeping their own balance. That's what keeps people together.
Chantelle Dyson 33:18
Because I think boredom in a relationship comes from like boredom is that I don't know what the definition is. It's like the same thing. Like the reason that school gets the same thing. Same topic, same people in this room and then suddenly go off to college or uni, like, Oh, my God, this is great. I mean, really, it's just a change of scenery, you're still learning, you're probably doing something little bit different. It's fresh and new. And so actually having this having your independence alongside a relationship, which is, it's so necessary, because if you're only identity is girlfriend, wife, whatever it might be, you know, parents, like if you predominantly only fall into one of those, you lose everything else. Whereas if you get to be all three plus, I don't know what else you could be but like, dance instructor, if that's something that you do, and you go and do it in your runner, and you go and be part of a team running group, and you get these other identities, coming home, and all whatever version coming back to that person is that I think there's another quote around the best form of love is to see when you actually go away from someone and come back, seeing it daily doesn't do you just get used to it, it becomes non habitual. What I mean is a chore is actually having a week off, go on all day with your friends for a week. Come back and tell us not to because that's the bit that makes you realize these friends are lovely, but spending a week with them. That's enough, you know that we love you like that'd be great. They're great for an evening tonight. This seven days has been great, but hell, please come home and just lie and scroll on my phone next year because now I appreciate you so much more because you just deal with me and their drama. Like as much as I love. See whatever it might be, you know, we forget how good someone is for us or not or, you know, whatever it might always have been.
Sarah Elizabeth 35:08
well loved, loved. So if we haven't put people off enough, you have got your no bullshit Guide to Dating to help us date the clever way would that would that kind of work for some of our older listeners, that program that you've got there?
Chantelle Dyson 35:23
Absolutely. That's just one of my little guides that I have something that I put together because I wanted people to realize that they're stuck in a cycle of dating. So dominantly people, download the app, spend a load of time doing that, they might whittle it down to a few people through their chats. And then you get excited by one and basically put all your eggs in one basket too soon. And at some point, they end it and you decide you're gonna delete the apps. Because you're done with day in it's not worth it. Not for you, even though the truth is, is that you know, you do probably if you're on the app, chances are you do want a relationship. But there's a reason. Yes. Whereas instead, we just take it a bit easier, we do our due diligence to avoid having poor dates, the aim is to have better dates, with less time commitment, given up doing it slowly and steadily. So my number my stats are, if I can remember off top of my head, I have 80 numbers in my phone that have like Bumble hinge at the end of them have, yeah, tons of conversation I had over three years, I only out of those 80, even that made it through that filter only ever went on first dates with 16, across three years. So five people a year, I went on a first date with eight of them were on a second date. So like serial date, oh, I'm gonna meet loads of people not right. Well, you can if that works for you. But I mean, if you're still dating and doing that, it's probably not worked for you yet. But my point is, you filter people before you meet them, and give them a higher chance of being a second day. So then that's why I've got that 50% From 16 to eight get to second dates, that's because they were decent people, we wanted to see each other again. And obviously only one worked out, I think three or four of them got to like being over three or four weeks long, you know, like starting to get into that realm of, oh, you're testing it out a bit more than just being a first date. But ultimately, they didn't work. But yeah, like not, not feeling so desperate, we have to keep going on dates every Thursday, Friday night, but just to the point, what you want, and you don't go on any other day, unless you're in. There's the experimentation exception, where you need to go on quite a few dates start to work out like what you like and what you don't like. Because if you need or you haven't done it for a while you have to you want a few dry runs. So you want to go there that part because a lot of people are thinking, what if the first one is a disaster? Or let's do it with someone that we don't think we definitely that really like? Let's just say yes to almost anyone ish. Let's talk to people practice what it's like going on a day, get used to general old like this. Yeah. And then like, after you've done that, you're like, What I liked what he did didn't like that I prefer first dates or coffees or I prefer going for drinks, whatever it might be. And then you start to decide on your preferences. After that, once you feel like you know a bit more about what you want, then that's when you start filtering down and going right. I'm only talking to them if they make it past these few stages through so yes, that's there and available.
Sarah Elizabeth 38:23
I'll make sure that I love that because that you've moved towards the single girls club right to the single spark. And that's what that's about, right? It's finding your own spark in yourself. Not necessarily a spark in the relationship.
Chantelle Dyson 38:39
It's both. Yeah, so The Single Girls Guide to Life was my the name of my podcast originally. And it did lots of life elements of being single, your 20s and 30s. And now what we do is we have this whole single spark, which is the combination of finding your single spark in yourself. And being that complete best version of you. I don't love that phrase, and it just gets thrown around. But I'm genuinely mean it from what you've heard on this episode today of knowing who you are, like, truly deeply, you say something to me, and I'll tell you what the decision is. I'll tell you why. Because I know my values, real strong. I like I know what matters to me. So you won't convince me to go to an event. If I don't think it's right for me to go to an event, peer pressure, family, whatever, you can throw it at me and I'll be like, I've said no. And this is why. And I'll communicate that with you and I might cause some difficulties. But I've made my decision. And I'm not afraid about and I know somebody will be like oh no, you can't say no. If you're like mementos, you will go to an event and well I can and I know it might even being 10 or 20 years older than me, but some people still just would go because that but it's family you've got to go and it's like if you don't if you don't really want it's not going to serve you. So getting that back and then being able to do all these things with solo trips with your top five friends with the peripheral people there. I was well, and going and having this life that you love doing, having all that sparked in your day, you don't care what happens on the day. That's the beauty of it. Whereas if you don't do that first bit, you end up going on the date expecting that to fix everything and bring the sparks. And it does a little bit until it wears off. And you realize, like, oh, that feeling of loneliness is still there. This isn't everything I wanted it to be, because you didn't work out your life being fulfilled in the first place. But chances are, when you work that bit out, and you actually get it to a stage, it doesn't have to be that your life is 100 Perfect or anything like you enjoy it 80% of the time, you're not going out doing what you're doing. Okay, maybe maybe the relationship status isn't where you want it to be. But actually everything else is. So this is what I've got. But then when you go on dates, you're living this great life. And people are attracted to that, that people are attracted to the fact that you didn't sit and wallow that you aren't sat there going, I just want to find someone to be with date is really hard. You're like, oh, well, I've been going to this festival and I went and did this on might you've got stories to tell you're interested in like, why wouldn't people want to date someone like yourself, and now they've got to meet your standard, not anything like you need to be good enough for them or anything like that, it's it gets you making the sparks in dating, because you've got such a fulfilled life, that it will never put people off because you're too much for them. And they're like, they need someone that's not that that point, or be like tha's great a that's the kind of person I want to be with. And I need to need to up my game because she's not gonna accept this for someone that's got their life sorted. And some people would argue with me that that doesn't put you in your feminine energy, it makes the man feel like they can't be in the masculine. I just disagree with that. Because we're all
Sarah Elizabeth 41:42
like you. So what I think is having strong healthy boundaries, right? And knowing that you say, knowing your worth knowing your value, and not settling for anything less. That's, funnily enough, I'd said that on the recent episode about the high point dependence again, it's about the masculine feminine energy, we go into that masculine, red, doing energy. And that might be him. But if that's who you are, so you shouldn't really have to compromise yourself with somebody else.
Chantelle Dyson 42:18
Yeah, and I don't compromise on that massively with dating at all. And it's always we had this interesting question that always bugged him, which is, it was one of those that came up on tech topics that you asked the couples in here, it's like Mr. And Mrs. You know, like, who is the boss? And I was like, I am and I'd made a joke about it about a couple of weeks before and it really triggered he was that I really don't like you say that you're the boss. But I was and then when the question came up with this video, I was like, I am the boss don't wanna, and he was like, hang on, let's talk about this. I was like, I'm basically like, 100%, the boss, if we have to say it, but you're 99% the boss, like, I'm just if a decision needs to make it about doing something, we're going to look to me to go what's going to be done about it, like the quickest and because that is who I like, I'm a manager. And I'm not a manager, per se, but I am a manager a thing. Project manager of a you know, Key Stage Three leader head of year, like it's just always in classroom, you're even as a teacher, if you're red energy. In that sense, you're gonna be because you're used to telling kids what to do. And I don't do that there's a rule, there's this, there's that you've got to have that about you. It's that whole idea of, even if it does trigger something, and I don't like that idea. Well, hang on, let's talk about it. Because I don't think that you're, it doesn't make you the girl. It doesn't make you feminine. But I also don't think you need to save me, but I definitely want you to cook the dinner if you'd like to. Because he laughs that like and it doesn't doesn't make a difference. If that's who you are. I wouldn't try to I shouldn't try to be feminine, because someone says that I should be. And someone that has made to be more masculine to fit in a particular way shouldn't go that way, like you say, because that's what people can sense that and that's what goes wrong in leadership. A good friend of mine was talking to me about that and Andy missavich. And I was saying to him, how do I fit into being red so much? And it's okay, other people are the women get commented on about that not working. And he was like, sometimes that's because they're trying to act more masculine and dominant, and they're not that way inclined, there's just different styles of leadership, they should lean into their natural as opposed to trying to be more like the male model. Because that I mean, unfortunately, that's what society looked at. Isn't it male, that male dominance, masculinity is what people look out for now. So when you are a female doing that, I think it sits fine. It's when someone that's not really that way inclined, so I just do it naturally. I don't even think about it. Whereas I think, I think can be sensed I think when you're trying to go I need to say something more assertively. Oh, I don't like but that's not your style, whereas I'm, I will say it probably quite assertively sometimes just to try and be soft, but then I would probably be picked up on if I was trying to be too soft people when you're acting. You're not as soft as you are. You're not as vocal as nice as you are. It's like you get the Bossy one note. Yeah. You get called bossy. If you're not I will just tell you how it is. And we need to get on with it because I don't have time. But I'm aware that I'm aware of those things. And I think self awareness is, whilst we're on it, one of the other biggest things that you develop in any personal development journey is what hangs on, you can't spot what you're doing wrong in date in the way you communicate. I know my floors I know I'm very direct, read fast, but probably spoken too fast on this, some of you will be like, times 0.8 Instead of times 1.5. Because for once, you can't actually keep up your phone. Now no one's no one's got it. No one is great at everything. And no one's everyone's cup of tea, man, we're dating, life relationships, people 20% of people gonna like you, like love you 20% of people gonna hate you in the 16% in the middle don't care either way. So something to take was that clear? Or looking today? There'll be some people that you don't like, and they don't like you either. Yeah, that's just the way life goes, isn't it? Absolutely. 100% agree with that. Yeah. And I think that's it is, comes back to it all comes back to knowing yourself or finding yourself. I'm finding your spark, right? Yeah, that's it and taking it.
Sarah Elizabeth 46:18
Wherever you go. Love it. I love this. This has been such a cool conversation. Chantelle. What one key bit of advice would you give to listeners to take away if you could only give one piece of advice to find your spark off the divorce what would it be?
Chantelle Dyson 46:39
I think most people doubt themselves, when they're finding their spark finding themselves. And they worry what other people are going to think about them. I'd go and read up on Ronnie wears Five Regrets of the Dying as a general gist. But anything to do with going to think about the end of your life is really good. Because I didn't stay in my relationship, my marriage, because I was like, I would be disgusted with myself angry with myself. If I was seven at whatever age on my deathbed. And I'd stayed knowing that it's probably not what I wanted to do. And so every element that I have now is or is always comes back to what would I think if I was at the end, and this was highlighted to me when I had an operation coming up for an ovarian cyst it was it was a massive system and how it grown, but they make you sign off the thing where it says, oh, there's a one in 1000 chance you might die through this operation. Oh, that sounds great. That really freaked me out. I know we're all gonna go at some point. But that writing it and signing a contract say yet doesn't matter if it happens. Completely. Yeah. 100% in I don't want this to happen, obviously. And the chances are very small. But I still don't want to have a because I don't feel like I'm done yet. And the idea that if I think anything to do with death, because it's very ultimate, whether it's end of life, and you give yourself 50 years, and you look back or if you go if you die tomorrow, would you be happy with everything you've done? Like, just think of it that way? If I died the day after I went to that thing that I was told I had to go to? Because it's family like, would I have been happy with going to it? If you go no, then just don't go just really anything like that makes me it really gets me driven to think I don't want to do that. Or I do want to do that. So sort of death exercises as morbid as that sounds.
Sarah Elizabeth 48:22
Just interesting. I've never really heard it like that before. I've heard that there was an article New York Times and I can't remember the guy that wrote it, David something or other that said about eulogy values versus CV values. And it's like, you write down your values, what you would put on a CV, what you'd put on, if you were going for a job or who you want to be. But actually, what would you want people to say about you and your eulogy? And who's that person because that's the person that you want to bet. So I've heard it like that before, but I've not heard that death exercise. So what how would you want to if tomorrow was your last day? How would you want to live it? I love that. That's so that's so interesting. Now I've got one more question. I can literally we could talk all day. There's so many so many bits of my list that I was going to talk to you about about we're gonna talk about holidays, we were going to talk about all sorts. But one more question. As you know, I host the divorce Book Club, which is a monthly membership podcast based on divorce relationships and all things personal development. Now I know you love books as well. If you had one book that you could say has had the most impact on you, what would it be and why?
Chantelle Dyson 49:38
Oh, I've already mentioned to you why. I'm just gonna like I'm gonna tell you to go back to the quote bit and listen to the bit where I said the quote because right before I said the book, that book allowed me to understand why we're disconnected in the world and it gives you seven or nine ways to reconnect to law. So you should just go read that because it didn't make a big difference. But I think another one if you're interested in doing the Work on yourself to and it's quite hard to get a copy of this, like it's all secondhand. I don't think they do new published books of it, but it's called You were not born to suffer by a Blake D bowyer. And what I really liked about that is it's not like scientifically qualified or anything. But it literally goes into some of the core stuff that you might do the work with, say, a counselor or something like that. And it's got these little chapters at the end of each chapter, there's basically a bunch of questions for you to sit right through an answer. Now, I don't think I've ever got to the end of it, because I didn't feel like I needed it. But I think some of the chapters and the exercises were really good like writing some letters to people that you wish you'd done things differently in your life or that you'd want to say. We'd say to them that that's what's bringing to mind it wasn't what's there. It was quite a long time I did it. But it's one that I recommend to a lot of people that I find are suffering in some way. It's quite general. It's not specific. But I really do you think it's, it's great, because he's got that element of pause, do this exercise, and then move on and go there. So as well as the other book Lost connections by your hand, I yeah, you will not want to suffer by Blake D. Bauer. I think there's so many others that I could have mentioned that a more literature based, but they're my they're my real top to know your divorce stance, but I think you can interpret it from a divorce single life.
Sarah Elizabeth 51:20
Yeah, totally going on my to be read list. Amazing. Always like, like more on my TBR. Brilliant. Thank you so much. Where can listeners find you if they want to learn more?
Chantelle Dyson 51:32
Yeah, great question. So you've got the single spark podcast that comes out every week with a little moment every week. Additionally to that if you want to follow it's Instagram or Tiktok, which is actually until the coach and then the same for was not at its WWW dot Chantelle the coach.com. And Chantelle spelt e ll e at the at the end for the CH at the start. We'll see how that goes. I don't know if how people spell Chantelle nowadays.
Sarah Elizabeth 51:56
I'll put I'll put all the links in the show notes as well. Is there anything coming up particularly that that we can point listeners to
Chantelle Dyson 52:07
No there is not specifically then there is a new programme coming out, it will be coming out in autumn time, but it's all under wraps. The all part of this new era of the single spark Podcast coming out that was after The Single Girls Guide to Life had taken a pause. And it's very much more about this slow, steady approach to finding yourself being the best version of yourself and then dating as well in a very mature way rather than being all giddy and excited like you are in your 20s and getting carried away. So yes, there's stuff
Sarah Elizabeth 52:42
that we'll all be watching here. Obviously I follow you so I'll be watching for then. So do go and check out Chantelle for the inspo for that and keep an eye on what's coming. You've been just amazing. Thank you so much. I literally could talk to you. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast and say I really appreciate it and I think it's been really helpful. So thank you to to listeners for listening to Chantelle and the divorce chapter and I will be back in your beautiful earbuds again next week. So until then, sending you so much love Thank you Chantelle.
